Curse

viper11025 · Aug 19, 2009, 01:20 AM // 01:20

My computer is old, really old. I am going to be making a "Beast" in terms of the best computer I can for 5k or under. I will also need to consider while in the Army I will need something mobile for home away from home.

Here is the Laptop.
NP9850 - From Sager
- Display: 18.4" Full HD (1920 x 1080) Display
- Processor: 45nm Intel® Core™ 2 Extreme Processor QX9300 / 12MB L2 Cache, 2.53GHz, 1066MHz FSB[+$915.00]
- Video & Graphics Card: Dual Nvidia GeForce GTX 280M Graphics with 1GB DDR3 Video Memory in SLI Mode
- Operating System: Genuine MS Windows® VISTA ULTIMATE 64-Bit Edition with Upgrade to Windows 7 Ultimate 64 Coupon[+$110.00]
- Memory: 8GB DDR3 SDRAM at 1066MHz - 2 X 4GB[+$685.00]
- RAID Storage Options: Non-RAID Storage
- Primary Hard Disk Drive: 500GB 7200rpm SATA 300 Hard Drive[+$60.00]
- Optical Drive: 2X BD-R Blu-ray Burner/8X DVD±R/2.4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software[+$395.00]
- Wireless Network Card: Intel Wi-Fi Link 5300AGN - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module
- Bluetooth: Internal Bluetooth V2.1 Module
- Primary Battery: Smart Li-Polymer Battery Pack
- TV-Tuner: TVT-6010, USB ATSC HDTV / ANALOG TV TUNER[+$85.00]
- MCE Remote Control: Compact Media Center Remote Control & IR Receiver, fits in Express Card slot[+$45.00]
- Integrated Security Device: Fingerprint Reader
- Microsoft Office: Microsoft Office Ready with Free 60-Day Trial
- Warranty: Sager 1 Year Limited Parts and Labor Warranty
- Carrying Bag: Standard Carrying Bag

Is the best I can get for under $5k? ($4,794)
Can it last me at least 4 years? Gaming terms.

Warning HUGE list:
Best I can get for under $5k? ($4,656)
Will 910 Watts be enough for all this?
And do you think it will last me at least 6 years? Like my last one did.
Note: Gifts are not included.

(Too much, Removed)

What is the goal of all this? Not to blow my money, but invest in an idea I hope to last me as long as a car or my old PCs. $5,000 takes me 7 months to make after my bills, and thats a big commitment when compared to if I add living cost and food.
I have Vista 64bit if I get the desktop.

Burst Cancel · Aug 19, 2009, 01:30 AM // 01:30

This is a fool's errand, frankly. You can build a machine that will last just as long, for a third of the money. You can't futureproof yourself by spending more money all at once; your top-end machine will solidly outperform the midrange only for about six months to a year. It's much more intelligent to build a mid-range machine every few years than to build a high-end machine twice a decade. You'll spend the same amount of money over the same amount of time, but get more consistent performance.

Case in point: nearly every component you've listed is a waste of money.

viper11025 · Aug 19, 2009, 01:36 AM // 01:36

Thats kinda the reason I'm here asking ,what can I chop off and still get the performance to play something as heavy as GoW at full?
Sounds like a waste, but laptops really suck in comparison, future proof is not always the best thing, but considering I'm looking at 3 deployments ASAP when I finish all this training.......come home to a 2,000$ piece of paper weight would really suck.
Had that happen to a friend of mine, he couldn't play Halo 2 on PC at even half setting with a 3$k machine, so he had to replace half of it at least.

Time is not on my side at all, I have a machine here still on a 3GHz P4, and It's lasted me longer than my old car for 1/4th the price.
>.<
(Totaled...the ladies fault beside me, lol)

Link6590 · Aug 19, 2009, 01:59 AM // 01:59

Okay... Just wow o_O..

910 watts is fine. Newegg.com PSU calc shows about 764W (threw in extra stuff just in case) for the bare esensensal installation (ODD, HDD, GPU, CPU, Memory, and Mobo). And i'm sure nothing else you have on that list will push it over that.

But what i really have conflicts is all the stuff u listed there is the state of the art, top of the line atm. Scaling back your GPU just to 285 would save you $200 and you'll never ever notice the difference. Heck, I'm sure going all the way down to 260 won't even affect gaming unless your running some insane resolution on a game 3 years from now.

Another thing is the i7. Many people won't be needing an i7 in general. Its only for the programmers and people running virtual machines. In terms of gaming, its overkill. And with your choice of i7 specifically, wow XD, going all the way down to an i7 920, would save you $700. And in terms of gaming, your not going to see any noticeable differences past Quad cores.

Sure, it sounds lame to cut corned, but i felt like everything was just way too over done in the first place.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10305872
This thread has a very capable computer that would just as much performance (okay, maybe just a little less..) and would be just as future proofed as the one you listed.

As for a gaming lappy... I really, REALLY recommend just buying a $400-500 dollar one and just pour the rest into your desktop. Laptops are extremely limited in options once you buy them and only excel in terms of portability. (But if you must, any laptop with a 512MB videocard should be able to run all games at med settings, a 1GB videocard should run them at high settings. Also get a dedicated videocard. Heating is also a problem on laptops.)

Burst Cancel · Aug 19, 2009, 02:03 AM // 02:03

My point is that you can't really futureproof, regardless of how much money you spend. Luckily, if all you really do is gaming, you can stay current just by upgrading the video card every few years; gaming tends to be CPU-limited only in rare cases.

Rather than telling you what you can drop, it's a lot easier to just start over. Take a look at these system guides:
http://www.anandtech.com/guides/showdoc.aspx?i=3610
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=218744

Generally speaking, buying the top-end parts like extreme-edition processors and dual-GPU cards is a waste of money. Expensive soundcards are also a waste of money unless you have the equipment to support them (a good amp and good headphones/speakers - "multimedia" stuff from Logitech et al. is not good); and in any case, the best soundcards at the moment come from Asus, Auzentech, and HT|Omega.

You can also save a bunch of money by dropping unnecessary extras like UV cables, fan controllers, cable sleeving kits, etc. Granted, aesthetics are each individual's choice, but seriously sit down and think about what you're paying for and whether it's really worth it to you. While each item may only be $10 or so, it adds up really quickly. Consider: drop those extras and you'd have enough money for a second video card.

Blu-ray burners are a waste of money right now unless you absolutely must be able to burn blu-ray this instant. The longer you can delay this purchase, the less it's going to cost you.

Lord Sojar · Aug 19, 2009, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Burst Cancel is correct on all points. Unless you have money that is just sitting around being wasted and you don't need it for anything else, then never build a bleeding edge computer, EVER. Total waste of money.

If you want, we can put together a beast system that will devour anything, but with Windows7 and DX11 right around the corner, investing in a high end GPU at this point would be rather silly.

Sir Skullcrasher · Aug 19, 2009, 03:50 AM // 03:50

no offense 5k on a computer is a total waste not to mention the possibility that it will be obsolete in few years. I built my current computer not to long ago and the total cost was around $1900 to $2100.

Spec..
ASUS P6T6 WS Revolution board
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz
12GB G.SKILL 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 Triple Channel Kit
2x Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 7200 RPM HDD
1x Western Digital VelociRaptor 300GB 10000 RPM HDD
2x EVGA GTX 285 SSC
Corsair CMPSU-1000HX 1000W Power Supply
LG Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner
Windows Vista Ultimate 64bit edition
Antec 1200 case

I would consider my new system to be workable for 5 to 6 years (heck even 10 years if all the parts last that long!)

viper11025 · Aug 19, 2009, 06:19 AM // 06:19

I agree completely with you all, this computer build would be a total waste of at least 2K. Please help me decide on what options are out there.
Heres my main goal, just not sure how to say it.
When the new year cards roll out I wan't to be able to upgrade easily and with no effort right before GW2 launches and the requirements are final.
For now I need something that will upgrade ASAP with no issues when it hits, I'm predicting the usual holiday sales and cut downs then the 2nd quarter "new" cpus and gpu's.
I would love to see a comparison using the wolfenstein of the 295 and the 260...GTX.

I plan on cutting down big time on this build, and I mean strip it to the bones.
But also use the I7 platform and perform at the level of 60fps with all bells and whistles on when playing Aion or any other beastly game.

So here is want to know.
Using that motherboard,HDD fan, ram, power-supply, and the 300g HDD.
What can I take off?
What can replace it?

(I know 5k is a waste, but I really wan't some help on this idea of mine, a quick upgrade and go when next 2 years roll around, It would really bite to come home and have to rebuild my entire machine to play the "next new killer game". I remember when Doom3 hit, the same thing happened to my uncle. He had to replace his cards and ram just to play it at full)

Elder III · Aug 19, 2009, 02:23 PM // 14:23

are you trying to get a killer laptop AND a beast of a desktop for a combined price of $5000? I just want to have that clarified before I delve into any build suggestions. In any case you can build a computer that will last 5 years or more for 2k or less right now... if the heaviest graphics you intend to throw at it are GW2 and Aion then you can cut down even more on the cost.

viper11025 · Aug 19, 2009, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Elder is on the right track, here is what I need.
I would like to find a laptop that will last me 4 years, but under $5k.
I need to build a computer using these items.

Thermaltake VA9003BWS Black Aluminum/1.0 mm SECC ATX Full Tower Computer Case
Western Digital VelociRaptor WD3000HLFS 300GB 10000 RPM
ASUS VW266H Black 25.5" 2ms(GTG) HDMI Widescreen LCD Monitor
2 X ASUS ENGTX275/HTDI/896MD3 GeForce GTX 275 896MB
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Champion Series 70SB088600007 7.1
OCZ Flex EX Series 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600
Foxconn BloodRage LGA 1366 Intel X58
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz LGA 1366 130W
Nexus FRIZZBEE Inaudible HDD Cooler
With the rest = $3K (2,900+)

What I have built now currently seems still too pricey.

Whats a good, but cheap power protection that gives me 20min to shut down the computer in a power failure?

Whats a good set of headphones with a Mic, that gives me at least 5.1 sound?

Is there a cheaper power supply that will still do the job and need no upgrade for the next set of cards?

Whats a good DVI to HDMI cable for under 12$?

Whats a good I7 CPU cooler that will last, and not burn out like some reviews tell me on NE?

Wheres a SLI connector?

Elder III · Aug 20, 2009, 01:34 AM // 01:34

Take the money and buy a new laptop every year for $1250 and you will come out far ahead... that way you can sell the old one every year for 4-500 or more. Spending $5k on a lptop means it will most likely have so much high powered stuff crammed into it that it will be very prone to over heating and failing eventually.

Liam_UK · Aug 20, 2009, 03:11 AM // 03:11

you really could build a great desktop for less than 1k and upgrade it when needed, if any thing at least wait for windows 7 to be released, its only a month away xD
hd dvd + blue ray burners are pointless if its for storage, get a TB external HDD

viper11025 · Aug 20, 2009, 05:21 AM // 05:21

Malician · Aug 20, 2009, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper11025

What do you mean by "need to build using these items?"

Specific tips:

You do not need ANY extra sound card unless you know (very specifically) why the onboard sound won't suffice. Save $200.

A fast 7200 RPM drive can be had for about $75 and will perform just fine for most use. The Raptor drops access time a third or half. That will cut a few seconds off boot time and less off application loading. An SSD will reduce access time to about a thousandth as much (Intel X25-M or OCZ Vertex.) 80 gigs or so will cost you a bit more than the Raptor but the performance is ridiculous and the machine will be much smoother in everday use. Save $150 or spend a bit more to get the real thing.

You don't need a $190 power supply. http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

More generally:

I recommend following tomshardware.com, anandtech.com, and arstechnica.com to get a handle on PC performance. Do not start pricing out things now when you are going to buy three months from now; instead, just start learning what's out there.

Elder III · Aug 20, 2009, 03:34 PM // 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malician

I recommend following tomshardware.com, anandtech.com, and arstechnica.com to get a handle on PC performance. Do not start pricing out things now when you are going to buy three months from now; instead, just start learning what's out there.

Amen! - If you don't want to buy for 3 months you don't need to be pricing it out now. Check up on the sites mentioned (I like the first 2 listed and www.guru3d.com myself) - Learn about all that's out there and then you will be a very informed buyer when it comes time to actually purchase your new system. Prices now will have changed greatly in 3 months - esp with video cards, since ATI has a majot new release just around the corner and NVIDIA will be cutting prices to match ATI, as well as preparing for their major release in a few months (?).

There's nothing wrong with buying now - but if you intend to wait 3 months then you should at least see what the GPU prices will be after ATI's new series is released.

viper11025 · Aug 20, 2009, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Ah!
That is the key to the lock I needed!
Thank you for the sites, now to start digging!
^_^

riktw · Aug 20, 2009, 11:42 PM // 23:42

please, next time link the important stuff only.
cabels are not imporant enough to link, and 20 tabs if i open everything in a tab is lame.
with your motherboard you get some cabels.
so link CPU, motherboard, sound card, VGA card, power supply, not stuff of 2 or 3 dollar please.

some tips
a 700 watt power supply is enough, really.
that sound card is overkill, onboard sound can be bad sometimes, my onboard sounds card makes noise when i scroll, but an 30 dollar sound card is enough.
an HD4890 is about is fast as an GTX275 and 30 or 40 dollars cheaper.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814150360

if your not going to overclock a lot, take a cheaper motherboard, as you wont use watercooling/LN2/peltier cooling that motherboard is overkill.
think about it, all those functions look good, but are you going to use them a lot?
here is an MSi motherboard thats 70 dollars cheaper:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813130226

that casing is expensive, you can look if you can find a cheaper one that you like.
and it got blue lights, add a red motherboard wont look nice i think.
a cheap case with lights and a windows is the recom powerstation.
and that cooler is not so good, and if your going to overclock its bad.
they the scythe mugen:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835185093
it will help a lot if your going to overclock, but dont be scared when your building your pc, its heavy but your motherboard can hold it

Zomgyogi · Aug 27, 2009, 02:26 AM // 02:26

The Bloodrage is an awesome Mobo! The best price : performance mobo and probably the only one that isn't overkill. 3 DIMM slots and room for only 2 dual slot GPUs.

Here ya go, comes out to ~$1320
CPU: Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz
Mobo: Foxconn Bloodrage
RAM: G.SKILL Trident 6GB (3 x 2GB) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
Case: Cooler Master HAF
HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB
PSU: Corsiar 850HX Modular 7 year warranty, ~85-90% efficiency, and so you can SLi/Xfire some DX11 cards.
CPU Cooler & fan The Megahalem will allow you to 4.0-4.2Ghz maybe even 4.2+ if you get a lucky chip.
Headphones: Sennheiser HD-555 + zalman clip on.

Case is a personal option, but the HAF has top notch on airflow and cable management. It also has sort of a military look so i thought you'd maybe like that

.
If you live near a Micro Center you can pick up an i7 920 for only $200 and you would also be guaranteed a D0 stepping (S-Spec = SLBEJ). You could also pick up the case there to save on the $20 shipping for it.
I would just wait for the new cards and you could buy a lower end card that will hold you over for a few months.

Unlees you are set on i7 and AMD build will save you ~$250 and offer similar gaming performance. Or you could wait for the i5s if you wanted.
Gigabyte UD5P
AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition Deneb 3.2GHz
G.SKILL Trident 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)

Just list w/e else you need. (Monitor, sound card, etc.)